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CREATOR INTERVIEW

Tarzan Kay has successfully built a business around her passion for writing engaging and “not-boring” e-mails.

She started as a copywriter, got into courses and grew her business to a million-dollar one very quickly. However, she made a conscious decision to scale back down because she didn’t feel comfortable with the evolution of the industry and her approach to sales.

However, throughout the entire journey, her newsletter Emails, But Better, remained the cornerstone of her business. Starting with just 37 subscribers, it blossomed into a highly engaged audience of over 10K subscribers.

In our interview, we covered a wide range of topics:

• How she grew to over 10K subscribers

• The importance of having a unique personal brand

• Why she’s an advocate of consent-based marketing 

• Her revised approach to sales

• How to achieve diversity & inclusion in the newsletter space

Now, I’m passing the mic to Tarzan Kay.

Let’s dive in!

🏷 NEWSLETTER IDENTITY CARD

🛠 TOOL STACK

• ESP → ConvertKit

• Writing → Google Docs

• Curation & Note-taking → Evernote & Apple Notes

• Task Management → Asana

• Productivity → Superhuman

• Brand & Webdesign → One6Creative

• Digital products → Searchie, Kajabi (which we’re getting rid of, just haven’t transitioned fully to Searchie)

• Payment → Stripe & Samcart

👋 MEET THE CREATOR

Welcome Tarzan. Let’s start with getting to know you.

I teach email marketing skills to course creators, coaches and service providers.

My emails are heavily story-based and I teach people how to write emails that are interesting, occasionally controversial and very reply-worthy. I have a signature program about email marketing (that I’m retiring this year to launch a more newsletter-focused program), a course about consent-based copywriting, a mastermind, plus I occasionally work with private clients.

In one of your latest issues, you mentioned that it’s important to know who you’re learning from and what their lives are outside of work. What do you want people to know about you and your work outside of work?

I’m a polyamorous queer who loves to slip random stories about my colorful life into emails about business. I’m a divorced mother of two who carries a ton of financial responsibility since my former spouse was a stay-at-home parent. (Divorce is expensive!)

I’m an advocate for safe drug use and often tell stories about my drug use to my email subscribers. I want to normalize conversations about substance use (and abuse) so that people can unlearn what they think they know about the war on drugs. That’s just one lever of my anti-oppression work.

🥁 START

You started your newsletter in 2016 and sent it to 37 subscribers. Why did you decide to start a newsletter in the beginning?

I started my business (and my newsletter) in 2016 because Marie Forleo said I should. That was a really good idea. My first emails went to a list of 37 subscribers, and was managed and convertkit.

I took a ton of online courses and the business grew very quickly. I worked as a copywriter, writing emails for course creators and coaches.

Very quickly, I pivoted to offer my own courses.

All of the course creators I followed were saying that anybody could be an expert, and anybody could have a course. I took that advice probably a bit too seriously and created my first email program in 2017. I sold four spots and was devastated that I didn't become an overnight millionaire.

But honestly, that did happen soon after.

A lot changed about your approach to your business since then. In your own words:

“I’ve been in the business for 7 years. I started as a copywriter, grew my business REALLY fast, and got into courses. Then, I scaled back down because I wasn't comfortable with the industry and the way people are taught to sell.”

Throughout that journey, how did the role of your newsletter evolve?

I grew my list with Facebook ads. It’s always been my primary marketing channel, and for the most part my only marketing channel. It also happens to be what I love.

I hate Instagram. It makes me feel bad about myself. I used to have a team that maintained a presence for me (I let my employees go in 2022 in the middle of my divorce, for a lot of reasons most of which were divorce-related).

For years I only sold other people’s programs with affiliate marketing.

In my third year in business I made $400K, most of it from affiliate marketing, some from my own programs. I sent tons of emails. I really hammered my subscribers with sales pitches and made them huge promises.

In year 6, I have my first (and only) 7-figure year, with a list of about 6K subscribers.

I have spent years atoning for the coercive marketing I used to do, with countdown timers, fast-action bonuses, transformational promises and many, many layers of persuasion.

🚀 GROWTH

Which growth strategies did you utilize to reach 9,900 subscribers?

That number was close to 15,000, but not all of them were active subscribers. I recently scrubbed a few thousand of them. Currently, my weekly newsletter goes to 9,900 subs, and my monthly edition goes to about a thousand. My subscribers can change the frequency of emails if it's too much. I encourage them to use this option. 

I’m a great speaker and did a ton of that in my first few years. The list growth from that was slow as molasses but many of those subscribers are still with me today.

I also speak on a lot of podcasts and occasionally teach in other people’s courses and masterminds.

I’m an absolute killer at live-editing emails. Nobody does it like me.

You’re an expert in onboarding new subscribers via well-crafted welcome sequences. What are the most critical factors to consider when creating a welcome sequence that will increase subscriber retention and engagement?

Thanks for noticing! A great welcome email should make people want to open the next one. Yes, it should educate the subscriber on delivery (“hit reply and say ‘I love Tarzan!’”) and tell them what to expect, but more importantly, it should be surprising and unique.

✅ CONSENT PRACTICES

Let’s discuss your consent practices and what “Consent” means specifically when it comes to lead magnets. 

Newsletter creators widely use lead magnets to grow their e-mail lists. However, you’re opposed to automatically adding anyone who signed up to download a lead magnet to the newsletter subscriber list. 

What is the right approach while using lead magnets to grow an e-mail list?

For most of the years I’ve been in email marketing, everyone in my industry was teaching list building with lead magnets. I still use them, but about 5 years into my business I realized that I wanted people to join for the emails, not the freebie, and adjusted my marketing for this change. 

Since GDPR rules came into effect, I’ve had checkboxes on all my forms and checkout pages. No one gets my newsletter unless they consent to getting it. They can grab the freebie and run if they want. 

I also give people the option to turn off promo emails, hide countdown timers or change the frequency of emails if it’s too much. There’s also a private podcast version if they don’t want them in their inbox at all (or want both).

More of my consent practices are on my About page, FYI - one important thing is that I’m fully transparent about pricing, affiliate links, newsletter swaps, etc.

I use really clear language because that’s critical for consent. You can’t say yes unless you know what you’re saying yes to.

Lead magnets definitely work. I’m so bored of them, tho. I want to write great emails, not create trashable PDFs. 

Based on your consent practices, how do you differentiate your monthly and weekly content?

The monthly has the most popular email of the month (main content section), plus it links to the month's emails and tells them what offers are coming up bc if they don't click to say "I'm interested," they won't even see the offer. 

We're strict about sticking to the 1x month schedule, as one of our consent-based practices. These subscribers do not get promo emails unless they opt-in for something by clicking a link that says, “Yes, I want to hear about [name of offer].

💸 MONETIZATION

Despite making great money with courses and being perceived as a “celebrity copywriter,” you decided to scale back your business in 2022. Now, you prefer to focus on small-group programs. 

How did scaling back your business impact your communication with your subscribers? 

No. I’ve always been super transparent with my email list and subscribers have followed me through all this change. One of my support non-negotiables is someone to upload, proof and schedule my emails. (Two people, actually.)

Of everything I do in my business, writing my newsletter is the  most important - it’s what I love to do, and it’s how I make money. This hasn’t changed in the 7 years I’ve been writing my newsletter. 

How do you leverage your e-mail list to introduce your courses with your current approach?

I sell a bit more passively than I used to, with links to offers at the top of my newsletter. (Imagine I were sponsoring myself.)

I still do timebound promotions for my bigger programs, and send maybe 10 sales emails, or less if they fill sooner than expected.

I still use bonuses now and then, but far fewer layers of persuasion.

✨ PERSONAL BRAND

Since many newsletter creators run solo businesses, building a personal brand is part of the business. You are very successful in this. You have a solid personal brand with a unique tone of voice, a high-quality website and a brand design. You also frequently include your pictures in your emails and social media posts.

What are the most critical ingredients of a successful personal brand strategy for you?

Hmmm…be really interesting? Don’t be boring? 

You have to know where to let people in and where your boundaries are. Oversharing makes people uncomfortable, as does excessive vulnerability. But strictly-business newsletters bore me to death.

It takes time for personal brand-newsletter operators to find their level when it comes to sharing. A lot of it is just practice. What stories do subscribers respond to? Which don’t?

My subscribers find this very refreshing because their inboxes are jammed with emails about how running a business will offer a life of ease and freedom, which they sense is complete B.S. but don’t always know for sure until someone they trust says it. 

🌐 DIVERSITY & INCLUSION

When we look at the newsletter experts, despite being relatively more female-skewed compared to the tech space, it feels like it’s still a boys' club. You often stress the importance of having diverse voices and gender inclusivity. 

What should be done to achieve gender inclusivity in the newsletter space?

Homogeneity is so boring.

I really wish podcasts and event hosts would work harder at finding more diverse guests. I love white guys and have befriended and/or dated many of them. I’m also raising two! And also, it would be so nice if they could take a seat now and then, and listen to the voices of non-white, non-males. What are disabled creators doing in the newsletter space that’s interesting, for example? How is it different to grow a newsletter as a person with a marginalized identity?

It can be hard for those guys to see that people who have less power, fewer subscribers and revenue, might still have something interesting to say.

(And by “those guys” I would also include a lot of female marketing bros who do all the same things.) 

📌 IMPACT & LEARNINGS

How did building your newsletter contribute to your life professionally and personally?

It’s everything to me. The whole reason I have this business. It’s given me a career as a writer, one that I’m so proud of.

Difficult as it is to be an entrepreneur, it’s given me a great life.

If you had a chance to start over, what would you do differently while building your newsletter?

Skip the part where I was a grifter on the internet selling snake oil.

What would it be if you had the right to give one piece of advice to aspiring newsletter creators?

🔗 Where to find Tarzan Kay

• Website

• LinkedIn

• Instagram

3 Popular Pieces of Content from Tarzan Kay

• Why Affiliate Links Feel Creepy

• Advice From White Guys

• When I said “ask me anything,” I didn’t expect this

👉 Do you want to reach over 2,100 newsletter creators & enthusiasts?

That’s all for today. Thanks for reading, and don’t hesitate to reply if you want to reach out to me.

See you on Wednesday.

Ciler